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Montgomery Castle Wales

Started by Imperial Dave, December 31, 2023, 07:27:47 AM

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Jim Webster

Be interesting to compare its record with some of the other Castles. Carlisle for example, Stirling, Dover, or the town of Berwick.
Mind you I suspect there are English castles who aren't on the borders who have had a busy past  :)

I can see Montgomery being up there, but it might be fun to know who does hold the record

Imperial Dave

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Erpingham

Quote from: Imperial Dave on December 31, 2023, 08:08:50 AMNot for the defenders... ;D

In many cases, of course, they sportingly swapped sides for the next round  :) I believe the record for England is held by Carlisle but don't know the UK record holder. Most English castles weren't besieged often, certainly.

Keraunos

Quote from: Erpingham on December 31, 2023, 01:28:14 PM
Quote from: Imperial Dave on December 31, 2023, 08:08:50 AMNot for the defenders... ;D

In many cases, of course, they sportingly swapped sides for the next round  :) I believe the record for England is held by Carlisle but don't know the UK record holder. Most English castles weren't besieged often, certainly.

My forebear, Thomas Salkeld, was sheriff of Carlisle for a time in the 16th Century and experienced a few attacks on that castle.  He was not a very nice man.  I seem to recall him being described in George MacDonald-Frasers 'Steel Bonnets' as the most hated man in England - going one better than a Mr Justice Salkeld in the 1320s who was simply the most hated man in Northern England.  Small wonder with ancestors like those that I skipped the country.

Nick Harbud

If one believes in judging a man by the quality of his enemies, your ancestors must have been truly great.  As a matter of interest, did they die peacefully in their beds?
Nick Harbud

Imperial Dave

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DBS

For a non-border fortification, I suspect Wallingford castle would be a contender for most contested in a shortish period, namely the Anarchy and the Barons' Wars.
David Stevens

Keraunos

Quote from: Nick Harbud on December 31, 2023, 03:32:48 PMIf one believes in judging a man by the quality of his enemies, your ancestors must have been truly great.  As a matter of interest, did they die peacefully in their beds?

It is hard to tell.  Records from the Northern Marches of England are none of the best, given the propensity not just of the Scots but of your neighbours to come and burn your house and records down around your ears.  Added to that, in the two main branches of the family there appears to have been a practice of giving only a handful of names to children.  On one side, if a son you were either a Thomas or a Lancelot.  On the other you were a Henry or a Henry.  This makes trying to work out who is being referred to in any particular document that does survive less than straightforward.  I gave up on trying to write a family history many years ago.  All I can say is that one Richard Salkeld of Corby Castle came to a sticky end after siding with Warwick the King-maker in his last bid to unmake a King, but I can't explain why he was called Richard or which branch of the family he came from.  More recently there was a Philip Salkeld of the Bengal Miners and Sappers who was given a VC for leading the forlorn hope that blew in the Cashmir Gate at Delhi in 1857.  He was the first person to be given the VC posthumously and did not, so far as I know, have any issue nor any clear connection with me.

Jim Webster

Certainly round here you get the impression that Christian names were on ration. In our family the first boy child was always called Francis. I know another family where they have managed for centuries with George, William, and John  8)

Erpingham

The Pastons are a famous medieval example.  Sir John Paston had two sons called John (living at the same time), both of whom were at some point knighted to make things even more confusing. 


Jim Webster

Quote from: Erpingham on January 01, 2024, 10:22:47 AMThe Pastons are a famous medieval example.  Sir John Paston had two sons called John (living at the same time), both of whom were at some point knighted to make things even more confusing. 



My lady wife does genealogy and it is common enough for families who lost a child to name the next of the same gender with that name.
So you can have families with several children called Ann, but only the last lived to adulthood, but they're all still on the record

Nick Harbud

Researching my ancestry, I came across a 19th century family who were evidently servants to an Oxford don.  Their 7th child was named Omega, indicating not only their family's association with an academic, but also, one suspects, their desire to limit its further expansion.  The latter objective was clearly not met as subsequent census returns indicate at least two additional progeny.

8)
Nick Harbud

DBS

Named Oooops, and Notagain?
David Stevens

Imperial Dave

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