Severed hands as trophies in New Kingdom Egypt

[Dave Beatty]

For an online copy of The Book of Jasher see http://www.sacred-texts.com/chr/apo/jasher/index.htm

[Jim Webster]

The problem I have with it is that I cannot trace it earlier than 1500

http://rsc.byu.edu/archived/apocryphal-writings-and-latter-day-saints/15-book-jasher-and-latter-day-saints

"What was this Book of Jasher being published in New York in 1840? It was the first printing of the English translation of an old Hebrew work entitled Sefer Hayasher. The work was first published in Hebrew in Venice, Italy, in 1625.[16] No known early or complete manuscripts for the book are extant, but one is mentioned in early Hebrew bibliographies as having been used by the first-edition printers.[17] It has been asserted that this work was first published in 1552 or 1613 in Naples,[18] but no known extant copy of such an edition has been found.

This Sefer Hayashar has appeared in at least thirty-two Hebrew editions or printings. I have non-critically examined a number of these various Hebrew printings and have found them to be apparently of the same text.[19] The first known translation from the Hebrew appeared in the Yiddish or Judaeo-German language by Jacob B. Jermiah Mattithialevi and was first published in Frankfurt am Main, Germany, in 1674.[20] A number of editions of this translation have also appeared through the years. In 1732 Johann Georg Abicht published the Book of Jasher in Latin in Leipzig.[21] His studies on this writing had been published earlier.[22] A French translation appeared in 1858, the work of Paul L. B. Drach.[23] The first English translation of Sefer Hayashar was published in 1840 in New York by Mordecai Manuel Noah.[24] He was not the translator, as some have asserted, but rather co-publisher with a Jewish printer of the day, Alexander S. Gould.[25] Mr. Noah was a prominent Jewish journalist, politician, writer, and publisher of his day. He has been characterized as "probably the most influential Jew in post-Revolutionary America."[26] It appears that Mr. Noah purchased the translation from England. The translator chose to remain anonymous because of the unfavorable climate created in his country by the publication of a Book of Jasher in Bristol in 1829, which also claimed to be the missing book mentioned in the scriptures.[27] This other Jasher had been first published in London in 1751, and its reappearance in 1829 caused a stir and considerable debate. Scholarly evaluation of this other Jasher exposed it as a fraudulent fictitious work which is most often referred to today as Pseudo-Jasher.[28] It was widely circulated and accepted in England, creating difficulties not unlike the problems we are reviewing here, and it was even confused with the Hebrew (Jewish) Book of Jasher which we are considering.[29] This controversy and debate continued there until the latter part of the nineteenth century.[30] It should be noted that this other Jasher is the one accepted and published by the Rosicrucian Order since 1934.[31]"

So I suppose we have to ask which Jasher?

Jim

[Patrick Waterson]

I should point out that the 'Book of Jasher' mentioned in "The translator chose to remain anonymous because of the unfavorable climate created in his country by the publication of a Book of Jasher in Bristol in 1829, which also claimed to be the missing book mentioned in the scriptures." is in fact the Book of Jesher, the son of Caleb, who is coincidentally the central figure in that particular book.

Dave has the correct Book of Jasher, and better that it reappear in 1625 or whatever than not at all.

It seems that it was widely known during the 7th century AD because the following story of Joseph in Jasher 44:

23 And Zelicah desired Joseph in her heart, that he should lie with her, and at the time that Joseph was sitting in the house doing his work, Zelicah came and sat before him, and she enticed him daily with her discourse to lie with her, or ever to look at her, but Joseph would not hearken to her.

24 And she said unto him, If thou wilt not do according to my words, I will chastise thee with the punishment of death, and put an iron yoke upon thee.

25 And Joseph said unto her, Surely God who created man looseth the fetters of prisoners, and it is he who will deliver me from thy prison and from thy judgment.

26 And when she could not prevail over him, to persuade him, and her soul being still fixed upon him, her desire threw her into a grievous sickness.

27 And all the women of Egypt came to visit her, and they said unto her, Why art thou in this declining state? thou that lackest nothing; surely thy husband is a great and esteemed prince in the sight of the king, shouldst thou lack anything of what thy heart desireth?

28 And Zelicah answered them, saying, This day it shall be made known to you, whence this disorder springs in which you see me, and she commanded her maid servants to prepare food for all the women, and she made a banquet for them, and all the women ate in the house of Zelicah.

29 And she gave them knives to peel the citrons to eat them, and she commanded that they should dress Joseph in costly garments, and that he should appear before them, and Joseph came before their eyes and all the women looked on Joseph, and could not take their eyes from off him, and they all cut their hands with the knives that they had in their hands, and all the citrons that were in their hands were filled with blood.

30 And they knew not what they had done but they continued to look at the beauty of Joseph, and did not turn their eyelids from him.

31 And Zelicah saw what they had done, and she said unto them, What is this work that you have done? behold I gave you citrons to eat and you have all cut your hands.

32 And all the women saw their hands, and behold they were full of blood, and their blood flowed down upon their garments, and they said unto her, this slave in your house has overcome us, and we could not turn our eyelids from him on account of his beauty.

is referred to in the Joseph Sura (Sura 12) in the Koran:

[12:30] Some women in the city gossiped: "The governor's wife is trying to seduce her servant. She is deeply in love with him. We see that she has gone astray."

[12:31] When she heard of their gossip, she invited them, prepared for them a comfortable place, and gave each of them a knife. She then said to him, "Enter their room." When they saw him, they so admired him, that they cut their hands.* They said, "Glory be to GOD, this is not a human being; this is an honorable angel."

A further detail in the Joseph Sura:

[12:24] She almost succumbed to him, and he almost succumbed to her, if it were not that he saw a proof from his Lord. We thus diverted evil and sin away from him, for he was one of our devoted servants.

[12:25] The two of them raced towards the door, and, in the process, she tore his garment from the back. They found her husband at the door. She said, "What should be the punishment for one who wanted to molest your wife, except imprisonment or a painful punishment?"

[12:26] He said, "She is the one who tried to seduce me." A witness from her family suggested: "If his garment is torn from the front, then she is telling the truth and he is a liar.

[12:27] "And if his garment is torn from the back, then she lied, and he is telling the truth."

[12:28] When her husband saw that his garment was torn from the back, he said, "This is a woman's scheme. Indeed, your scheming is formidable.

[12:29] "Joseph, disregard this incident. As for you (my wife), you should seek forgiveness for your sin. You have committed an error."

seems to have its origin in Jasher 44:

52 And Joseph returned and came to the house, and passed from thence to the place of his seat, and he sat down to do his master's work as usual and behold Zelicah came to him and stood before him in princely garments, and the scent from her clothes was spread to a distance.

53 And she hastened and caught hold of Joseph and his garments, and she said unto him, As the king liveth if thou wilt not perform my request thou shalt die this day, and she hastened and stretched forth her other hand and drew a sword from beneath her garments, and she placed it upon Joseph's neck, and she said, Rise and perform my request, and if not thou diest this day.

54 And Joseph was afraid of her at her doing this thing, and he rose up to flee from her, and she seized the front of his garments, and in the terror of his flight the garment which Zelicah seized was torn, and Joseph left the garment in the hand of Zelicah, and he fled and got out, for he was in fear.

55 And when Zelicah saw that Joseph's garment was torn, and that he had left it in her hand, and had fled, she was afraid of her life, lest the report should spread concerning her, and she rose up and acted with cunning, and put off the garments in which she was dressed, and she put on her other garments.

56 And she took Joseph's garment, and she laid it beside her, and she went and seated herself in the place where she had sat in her illness, before the people of her house had gone out to the river, and she called a young lad who was then in the house, and she ordered him to call the people of the house to her.

57 And when she saw them she said unto them with a loud voice and lamentation, See what a Hebrew your master has brought to me in the house, for he came this day to lie with me.

58 For when you had gone out he came to the house, and seeing that there was no person in the house, he came unto me, and caught hold of me, with intent to lie with me.

59 And I seized his garments and tore them and called out against him with a loud voice, and when I had lifted up my voice he was afraid of his life and left his garment before me, and fled.

60 And the people of her house spoke nothing, but their wrath was very much kindled against Joseph, and they went to his master and told him the words of his wile.

61 And Potiphar came home enraged, and his wife cried out to him, saying, What is this thing that thou hast done unto me in bringing a He. brew servant into my house, for he came unto me this day to sport with me; thus did he do unto me this day.

62 And Potiphar heard the words of his wife, and he ordered Joseph to be punished with severe stripes, and they did so to him.

63 And whilst they were smiting him, Joseph called out with a loud voice, and he lifted up his eyes to heaven, and he said, O Lord God, thou knowest that I am innocent of all these things, and why shall I die this day through falsehood, by the hand of these uncircumcised wicked men, whom thou knowest?

64 And whilst Potiphar's men were beating Joseph, he continued to cry out and weep, and there was a child there eleven months old, and the Lord opened the mouth of the child, and he spake these words before Potiphar's men, who were smiting Joseph, saying,

65 What do you want of this man, and why do you do this evil unto him? my mother speaketh falsely and uttereth lies; thus was the transaction.

66 And the child told them accurately all that happened, and all the words of Zelicah to Joseph day after day did he declare unto them.

67 And all the men heard the words of the child and they wondered greatly at the child's words, and the child ceased to speak and became still.

68 And Potiphar was very much ashamed at the words of his son, and he commanded his men not to beat Joseph any more, and the men ceased beating Joseph.

69 And Potiphar took Joseph and ordered him to be brought to justice before the priests, who were judges belonging to the king, in order to judge him concerning this affair.

70 And Potiphar and Joseph came before the priests who were the king's judges, and he said unto them, Decide I pray you, what judgment is due to a servant, for thus has he done.

71 And the priests said unto Joseph, Why didst thou do this thing to thy master? and Joseph answered them, saying, Not so my lords, thus was the matter; and Potiphar said unto Joseph, Surely I entrusted in thy hands all that belonged to me, and I withheld nothing from thee but my wife, and how couldst thou do this evil?

72 And Joseph answered saying, Not so my lord, as the Lord liveth, and as thy soul liveth, my lord, the word which thou didst hear from thy wife is untrue, for thus was the affair this day.

73 A year has elapsed to me since I have been in thy house; hast thou seen any iniquity in me, or any thing which might cause thee to demand my life?

74 And the priests said unto Potiphar, Send, we pray thee, and let them bring before us Joseph's torn garment, and let us see the tear in it, and if it shall be that the tear is in front of the garment, then his face must have been opposite to her and she must have caught hold of him, to come to her, and with deceit did thy wife do all that she has spoken.

75 And they brought Joseph's garment before the priests who were judges, and they saw and behold the tear was in front of Joseph, and all the judging priests knew that she had pressed him, and they said, The judgment of death is not due to this slave for he has done nothing, but his judgment is, that he be placed in the prison house on account of the report, which through him has gone forth against thy wife.

although Mohammed has the story, or at least the tear in the garment, the wrong way round, plus some other details; he remembered the key role of a 'relative' but not what that role actually was.

I am not sure if any other source preserves this story and the ladies-cut-themselves-through-surprise one.

[Jim Webster]

Actually it could as easily be a Hebrew document written in the 15th century using stuff from the Koran to pad out versions of the Old Testament.
Remember we have Josephus, Justin and Manetho
Also Jewish Literature produced an awful lot of Pseudepigrapha some of which were intended to be religious but some seem to have been mainly read for pleasure, some are comic.

There are plenty of possible Jewish sources that might have influenced both the Koran and Jasher, none of which need be earlier than the Christian era

Jim

[Patrick Waterson]

There are plenty of possible Jewish sources that might have influenced both the Koran and Jasher, none of which need be earlier than the Christian era

The temptation is to say: "Name three of them!"

At least we have moved back the date from 1625 to 'a possible Jewish source' rather earlier in 'the Christian era'.  And the source of that source might be even earlier ...

[Jim Webster]

There are plenty of possible Jewish sources that might have influenced both the Koran and Jasher, none of which need be earlier than the Christian era

The temptation is to say: "Name three of them!"

At least we have moved back the date from 1625 to 'a possible Jewish source' rather earlier in 'the Christian era'.  And the source of that source might be even earlier ...

Well actually your version doesn't go back before the 7th century.
The simplest explanation is that a Hebrew writer borrowed the ideas from the Koran. It is rather more convincing than the Book of Jasher mentioned in the Old Testament actually survived without anybody mentioning it

Jim

[Patrick Waterson]

The simplest explanation is that a Hebrew writer borrowed the ideas from the Koran. It is rather more convincing than the Book of Jasher mentioned in the Old Testament actually survived without anybody mentioning it

I cannot honestly see that happening: the Koranic version is more condensed and inaccurate in detail, as if drawn from an enthusiastic but imperfect memory, while the Jasher version provides details which are missing in the Koranic version but which make sense (the provision of lemons, the priests acting as judges) and also, crucially, differs on where Joseph's garment was torn, which it would not do if simply borrowing from the Koran.

So the simplest explanation is that copies of the Book of Jasher disappeared from the shelves at some point between the Hegira and the Renaissance and one subsequently resurfaced.  There were plenty of Jews around to preserve manuscripts the existence of which Christians would be unaware - and the said Jews, probably rabbinical guardians of archives rather than ordinary traders and moneylenders, would be in no haste to tell them.  The transmission of the Book of Jasher is conceptually easier to explain than the transmission of the Black Death.