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General Category => Army Research => Topic started by: nikgaukroger on April 10, 2019, 08:37:04 PM

Title: Shatuo and 5 Dynasties
Post by: nikgaukroger on April 10, 2019, 08:37:04 PM
Recommendations for where to look for information on these please. I have some but wondering what else is out there. Used to be stuff available on CHF but that is no longer in existence  :-[
Title: Re: Shatuo and 5 Dynasties
Post by: Andreas Johansson on April 11, 2019, 07:13:50 AM
Perhaps helpfully, I note there's an abridged English translation (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Historical-Records-Five-Dynasties-Ouyang-ebook/dp/B009CHDI1K/ref=sr_1_2?keywords=ouyang+xiu&qid=1554962986&s=gateway&sr=8-2) of Ouyang Xiu's Historical Records of the Five Dynasties.
Title: Re: Shatuo and 5 Dynasties
Post by: nikgaukroger on April 11, 2019, 07:27:15 AM
Got that one already thanks.
Title: Re: Shatuo and 5 Dynasties
Post by: Duncan Head on April 11, 2019, 09:15:34 AM
Eberhard's Conquerors and Rulers: Social Forces in Medieval China  (https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Conquerors-Rulers-Social-Forces-Medieval/dp/B0066F620U/) is the main study that I know of: not just about the Shatuo, but has a lot about them.

Richard Davis, who translated Ouyang Xiu, also has a biography of one of the Shatuo emperors: From Warhorses to Ploughshares: The Later Tang Reign of Emperor Mingzong (https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Warhorses-Ploughshares-Emperor-Mingzong-2015-05-26/dp/B01K16C26W/)

Edit: Oh, and this  (https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Dynasties-Kingdoms-Professor-Peter-Lorge/dp/962996418X/)was news to me...

Lorge's book on the Song reunification (https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Reunification-China-Peace-through-Dynasty/dp/1107446791/) obviously deals with the end of the Five Dynasties era.

There are also books on some of the Ten KIngdoms:

- Min (https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Empire-Min-South-Kingdom-Century/dp/1891640364/)
- Former Shu (https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Power-Politics-Tenth-Century-China-Former/dp/1604977647/)
- Southern Tang (https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Chinas-Southern-Tang-Dynasty-937-976/dp/1138657220/)
Title: Re: Shatuo and 5 Dynasties
Post by: nikgaukroger on April 11, 2019, 12:34:29 PM
Thanks - I think a couple of those will be on the ordering list  :D

Have the Lorge one on Song reunification (good IMO) but that other one was new to me as well - may just tip me over to Kindle unlimited ...
Title: Re: Shatuo and 5 Dynasties
Post by: Dangun on April 11, 2019, 01:11:41 PM
If you can find it, its got some good data...
Lai, S. F., Dissertation, The Military and Defense System under the Tang Dynasty, (Princeton, 1986)
But there is a bit of ra-ra too.

Not sure, if you want just the 5D Tang, or are interested in the Tang proper... Anyways, this was OK...
Zhenping, W., Tang China in Multi-polar Asia, (Honolulu, 2013)
Title: Re: Shatuo and 5 Dynasties
Post by: nikgaukroger on April 11, 2019, 01:37:25 PM
Quote from: Dangun on April 11, 2019, 01:11:41 PM
If you can find it, its got some good data...
Lai, S. F., Dissertation, The Military and Defense System under the Tang Dynasty, (Princeton, 1986)
But there is a bit of ra-ra too.

No joy in finding it - unless I want to go to Princeton and borrow it in book format from their library  :P

Title: Re: Shatuo and 5 Dynasties
Post by: Duncan Head on April 11, 2019, 01:41:19 PM
Oh, and there's always Wang Gungwu (https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Structure-Power-North-During-Dynasties/dp/B0006BRL32/) (or here (https://smile.amazon.co.uk/structure-power-North-during-dynasties/dp/B0000CLZMK/)) - the first book on the Five Dynasties I ever bought, back in the 1980s.
Title: Re: Shatuo and 5 Dynasties
Post by: nikgaukroger on April 11, 2019, 09:24:24 PM
Quote from: Dangun on April 11, 2019, 01:11:41 PM
Not sure, if you want just the 5D Tang, or are interested in the Tang proper...

5 Dynasties really, but Tang post An Lushan could be useful as it is the run up as the Tang state decentralises  8)
Title: Re: Shatuo and 5 Dynasties
Post by: nikgaukroger on April 11, 2019, 09:28:35 PM
Quote from: Duncan Head on April 11, 2019, 01:41:19 PM
Oh, and there's always Wang Gungwu (https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Structure-Power-North-During-Dynasties/dp/B0006BRL32/) (or here (https://smile.amazon.co.uk/structure-power-North-during-dynasties/dp/B0000CLZMK/)) - the first book on the Five Dynasties I ever bought, back in the 1980s.

Updated in 2007  - https://www.amazon.co.uk/Divided-China-Preparing-Reunification-883-947/dp/9812707921/ref=sr_1_fkmrnull_1?keywords=divided+china+preparing+for+reunification+883-947&qid=1555014442&s=gateway&sr=8-1-fkmrnull