Roman swords found in Israel

[Erpingham]

Nice find of well preserved Roman swords in the Dead Sea caves.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-66728207

[Nick Harbud]

Nice view from the cave entrance too!  One wonders how much effort was involved in caching the weapons there nearly 2,000 years ago?

 

[Duncan Head]

If it is indeed from the 130s, that's a very early ring-pommel sword:

"This type of sword originated around the mid-second century AD..."

Makes it a very interesting find.

[Imperial Dave]

oooh nice

[nikgaukroger]

I think the dating of the finds is still to be decided - https://www.israelnationalnews.com/news/376611 - there is always a tendency to try and match finds to major historical events and it doesn't always work out that way.

[nikgaukroger]

Also, over on Twitter, the Roman Military Equipment account (official account of the book  ) has said that the pilum find is a square sectioned spear head or possibly a catapult bolt.

https://twitter.com/EquipmentRoman/status/1699393808142655533

[Erpingham]

This report has a good picture of the so-called pilum head. It seems to lack the distinctive features of a pilum - small head and long shaft.

[Jon Freitag]

This report has a good picture of the so-called pilum head. It seems to lack the distinctive features of a pilum - small head and long shaft.

This looks much more like a lance/spear head to me.  Could this be of Spanish origin?

[Duncan Head]

This report has a good picture of the so-called pilum head. It seems to lack the distinctive features of a pilum - small head and long shaft.

Looks almost like a hoplite spear's butt-spike.

[Imperial Dave]

I tend to agree with you Duncan. Looks like a sauroter to me

https://sites.psu.edu/cams180hoplite/equipment/spear/

[Erpingham]

Looks almost like a hoplite spear's butt-spike.

Thank goodness you said that.  Like Dave, I thought that, but thought the Israeli archaeology service wouldn't make such a mistake.  But with your breadth of knowledge, for you to think it, certainly opens it up.  However, perhaps we are looking at re-use as a spear point?  If you are a guerilla stashing what weapons you can get, make do and mend might be where you are at.

[Duncan Head]

I don't know how likely it is to be a butt-spike, though, considering the apparent date. Roman spears, as far as I know, tend to have small "shoes" or else no butt-metalwork at all. Could it be something ceremonial, or a posh officer's weapon? It certainly looks like a sauroter, square cross-section and looking uncertain as to how sharp the point ever was, but I don't know how likely it is to actually be one.

[nikgaukroger]

I'll stick with the Roman Military Equipment view as its from such an authoritative source.

[nikgaukroger]

There is even a preliminary report available already 

https://www.academia.edu/106367108/Preliminary_Insights_following_the_Recovery_of_a_Cache_of_Roman_Period_Weaponry_from_the_Cave_of_the_Swords?email_work_card=title

[Duncan Head]

And if Guy Stiebel is prepared to put his name to an account that calls it a pilum, then that gives me pause for thought...