The defeat of Thalna by Andriscus 148 or 149 BC

[Dave Knight]

I came across a reference to this battle but have not been able to find detail.  The defeat of a Roman army by a Macedonian one was unusual and I thought it would be fun to recreate if I could get at least a few details.  There is a little bit on wikipedia, but that can be an unreliable source.

Can anybody help?

[lionheartrjc]

Livy ep 50 says "After the false Philip had massacred praetor Publius Juventius with his army in Macedonia, he was defeated and captured by Quintus Caecilius, and Macedonia was subdued again."

I think anything else is just guesswork.  If it follows the usual pattern I would guess the Romans sent an underprepared force commanded by an inadequate leader into a situation where they were outnumbered, ambushed or both.

My guess is whatever army Andriscus could field was probably a core of mercenaries and Macedonian followers.  Since Pydna, three of the four Macedonian republics had to defend their borders, so there were probably some reasonably experienced troops but my guess is most sensible Macedonians would have wanted nothing to do with a fight against Rome.

[Duncan Head]

According to Cassius Dio 21:

A certain Andriscus, who was a native of Adramyttium and resembled Perseus in appearance, caused a large part of Macedonia to revolt by pretending to be his son and calling himself Philip. First he went to Macedonia and tried to stir up that country, but as no one would yield him allegiance, he betook himself to Demetrius in Syria to obtain from him the aid which relationship might afford. But Demetrius arrested him and sent him to Rome, where he met with general contempt, both because he stood convicted of not being the son of Perseus and because he had no other qualities worthy of mention. On being released he gathered a band of revolutionists, drew after him a number of cities, and finally, assuming the kingly garb and mustering an army, he  reached Thrace. There he added to his army several of the independent states as well as several of the princes who disliked the Romans, invaded and occupied Macedonia, and setting out for Thessaly won over no small part of that country.

The Romans at first scorned Andriscus, and then they sent Scipio Nasica to settle matters there in some peaceable manner. On reaching Greece and ascertaining what had occurred, he sent a letter to the Romans explaining the situation; then after collecting troops from the allies there he devoted himself to the business in hand and advanced as far as Macedonia. The people of Rome, when informed of the doings of Andriscus, sent an army along with Publius Juventius, a praetor. Juventius had just reached the vicinity of Macedonia when Andriscus gave battle, killed the praetor, and would have annihilated his entire force had they not withdrawn by night. Next he invaded Thessaly, harried a great many parts of it, and was ranging Thracian interests on his side. Consequently the people of Rome once more dispatched a praetor, Quintus Caecilius Metellus, with a strong body of troops. He proceeded to Macedonia and received the assistance of the fleet of Attalus. Andriscus in consequence became anxious about the coast districts, and so did not venture to advance farther, but moved up to a point slightly beyond Pydna. There he had the best of it in a cavalry encounter, but out of fear of the infantry turned back. He was so elated that he divided his army into two sections, with one of which he remained on the watch where he was, while he sent the other to ravage Thessaly, Metellus, contemptuous of the forces confronting him, joined battle, and after overpowering those with whom he first came into conflict he very easily won over the others also; for they readily admitted to him the error of their ways. Andriscus fled to Thrace and after assembling a force gave battle to Metellus as the latter was advancing on his way. His vanguard, however, was routed, whereupon his allied force was scattered; and Andriscus himself was betrayed by Byzes, a Thracian prince, and punished.

"Thalna" is P Iuventius Thalna, the Publius Juventius of the Dio passage. The emboldened passage would suggest that a large part of Andriskos' army was Thracian. Can't find any further details of the actual battle.

[Dave Knight]

Thanks Duncan

So The 'Macedonian' army could be say 2/3 Thracian.

The Romans have their legion, plus allies.  Any thoughts on who the allies are likely to have been?

[Duncan Head]

The Romans have their legion, plus allies.  Any thoughts on who the allies are likely to have been?

Not really. Wikipedia suggests that Scipio Nasica had organized Thessalian and Achaian allies, so it might well have been them, but I don't know how reliable that suggestion is.

[Dave Knight]

Thanks again.  I will go with that.