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General Category => Army Research => Topic started by: Dangun on March 12, 2023, 07:10:34 AM

Title: Trajan's Column / Dacian Wars
Post by: Dangun on March 12, 2023, 07:10:34 AM
An appeal to those far more knowledgeable than myself. But which book has the most complete photographic record of the surface of Trajan's column? I am not fussy about the language, since I am most interested in getting a full set of images.

And apologies for possibly putting this question in the wrong section.
Title: Re: Trajan's Column / Dacian Wars
Post by: Trev on March 12, 2023, 11:46:56 AM
I assume you know about this site. http://www.trajans-column.org/ (http://www.trajans-column.org/)

Is there a particular reason you want a book or is that detail not good enough?

There's this one too for scrolling around but I don't think it has detailed images.

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/trajan-column/ (https://www.nationalgeographic.com/trajan-column/)

Title: Re: Trajan's Column / Dacian Wars
Post by: dwkay57 on March 12, 2023, 01:28:25 PM
I have copies of both the Rossi book and the Lepper & Frere one. The latter is slightly better as it is a larger format.

Depending upon where you live the Victoria & Albert Museum in London used to have casts of the column. Not sure if they are on display anymore or if the viewing galleries make it easier to spot the higher panels than the on the original.

PS. I was going to post a holiday snap of the original but the photo size was too large. :D
Title: Re: Trajan's Column / Dacian Wars
Post by: Erpingham on March 12, 2023, 01:53:53 PM
Quote from: dwkay57 on March 12, 2023, 01:28:25 PMDepending upon where you live the Victoria & Albert Museum in London used to have casts of the column. Not sure if they are on display anymore or if the viewing galleries make it easier to spot the higher panels than the on the original.



The V&A do still have their cast This article (https://www.vam.ac.uk/articles/trajans-column) tells you about its background.  It's quite a technical achievement. Being a 19th century cast, it is better preserved than the original in places.  Unfortunately the V & A don't seem to have a set of photos of all the scenes on their website.
Title: Re: Trajan's Column / Dacian Wars
Post by: Adrian Nayler on March 12, 2023, 02:17:26 PM
The only modern complete pictorial record that I am aware of is contained within Frank Lepper and Sheppard Frere (1988) "Trajan's Column" originally published by Batsford. This was reprinted in 2016, I think. Neither edition remains in print but both are seemingly still available second hand. This book republished the series of photographic plates originally published by Conrad Cichorius more than a century ago.

Fritz Mitthof and Günther Schörner (eds.) (2017) "Columna Traiani – Traianssäule. Siegesmonument und Kriegsbericht in Bildern" is a huge and free pdf ebook on the column and is available here.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.verlagholzhausen.at/fileadmin/buch.verlagholzhausen.at/Ebooks/PUB_475__Mitthof__Columna_Traiani_TYCHE.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwiDq4Wswdb9AhXIQkEAHd6_A-MQFnoECBIQAQ&usg=AOvVaw29nJZPL0E-lL7kktEvOBRW

There are many interesting plates at the back though nothing like a complete set (and it doesn't set out to do this). Many articles are in English.

A fine website for study of the column is maintained by the University of St. Andrews. Dr. J.C.N. Coulston has studied the column 'up close' during recent renovations to the column.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://arts.st-andrews.ac.uk/trajans-column/the-project/the-study-of-trajans-column/&ved=2ahUKEwiD4Nnbwdb9AhWQZ8AKHU7pB7E4ChAWegQIHxAB&usg=AOvVaw34z9wV8CWL_apkFsghB7Uu

Title: Re: Trajan's Column / Dacian Wars
Post by: Dangun on March 20, 2023, 01:24:32 AM
Thank you all. Much appreciated.

I had come across the Frank Lepper and Sheppard Frere (1988) "Trajan's Column" book before, but it is surprising that the most complete photographic record of an object that is so richly detailed and historically significant is over a 100 years old.

Thanks again.
Title: Re: Trajan's Column / Dacian Wars
Post by: Ian61 on March 20, 2023, 10:35:17 PM
Quote from: Dangun on March 20, 2023, 01:24:32 AM........ it is surprising that the most complete photographic record of an object that is so richly detailed and historically significant is over a 100 years old.
A pity that air pollution over that century will have done more damage. :(
Title: Re: Trajan's Column / Dacian Wars
Post by: Adrian Nayler on March 22, 2023, 02:13:20 PM
Further to Ian's message above, the friezes have indeed become degraded by pollution over the years.

Setting aside the organisational and physical difficulties of re-photographing the column in its entirety, it was apparently the effects of this degradation that caused Lepper and Frere to republish Cichorius' plates. Those original photographs were taken of the plaster casts newly made from the column. The casts preserve the state of the column as it was when they were made and are thus very valuable today.

The large size of the original photographic negatives make the resulting photographs remarkably detailed. Unfortunately, I suspect that the format of any modern re-pulication would likely be restricted to keep its cost commercially viable. Thus, the 1988 book is perhaps the best we can expect from a physical book today but that is not to say that we would not want larger images!

It is also unfortunate that the Museo della Civiltà Romana in Rome remains closed for renovation from 2018. For my money, they had the best display of casts arranged in order and at a comfortable head height for viewing. Should it reopen, I would urge anyone interested to try and visit. This will help one answer questions that may not be satisfactorily determined from the many previously published printed photographs.
Title: Re: Trajan's Column / Dacian Wars
Post by: tadamson on August 10, 2023, 12:31:14 PM
FYI
There is a set of the plastercasts in the V&A in London (and another set in Paris). Seeing them in the flesh is very revealing.