SoA Forums

History => Ancient and Medieval History => Weapons and Tactics => Topic started by: Chilliarch on November 11, 2022, 04:44:59 PM

Title: Cavalry Formations in the Hellenistic Period
Post by: Chilliarch on November 11, 2022, 04:44:59 PM
I don't know if this subject has been raised before and is more of a general query on my part. I did have a quick search but could not see more than recent discussions about wedges in general.

In the later Hellenistic period, is there any evidence of Macedonian cavalry continuing to fight in wedge formation? I was just wondering as the combats described (to my not always reliable memory) do not mention anything specific in this matter and I wonder if either different formations were so commonly known as to be beyond normal distinction or if cavalry formations reverted to line or square tactics?
Title: Re: Cavalry Formations in the Hellenistic Period
Post by: Duncan Head on November 11, 2022, 06:33:37 PM
There is, IIRC, no direct evidence of Macedonian cavalry at any date using the wedge, except for the tacticians.
Title: Re: Cavalry Formations in the Hellenistic Period
Post by: Chilliarch on November 11, 2022, 06:37:31 PM
Thank you. I hadn't spotted that. Would it still be a reliable assumption to treat them in Alexander's day as fighting in wedge?
If so, that certainly makes it possible that the later cavalry were fighting in similar formations, though all assumptions so far.
Title: Re: Cavalry Formations in the Hellenistic Period
Post by: Duncan Head on November 11, 2022, 08:38:25 PM
Aelian says that  it was Philip II who adopted the wedge for Macedonian cavalry, so it would not be unreasonable to assume that it was in use in Alexander's day.

After that, things are much less certain. It depends partly how late we consider that Macedonian cavalry were still charging lancers, or if we think Livy 31.35 indicates a tactical style less shock-based.
Title: Re: Cavalry Formations in the Hellenistic Period
Post by: Chilliarch on November 11, 2022, 10:44:46 PM
My inclination would be to think of them as charging cavalry, rather than skirmishing, since that was what I believe happened at the Kalinikos skirmish (if I remember Livy correctly). There is also the question of light infantry support with both sides mixing light foot (Cretans etc) and I recall Illyrians and Cretans being used to support Philip V's cavalry in the Second War.

Thanks for your comments. 😊
Title: Re: Cavalry Formations in the Hellenistic Period
Post by: DavidMcCann on November 12, 2022, 06:25:45 PM
Don't forget that the wedge and the diamond were troop formations, not squadron ones — just 1 to 3 figures, depending on the rules! A squadron made up of several wedges or diamonds would be represented on the table as a single line of figures, like most shock cavalry.
Title: Re: Cavalry Formations in the Hellenistic Period
Post by: Keraunos on August 15, 2023, 09:00:55 AM
Picking up, belatedly, on Duncan Head's citation of Aelian, this is all very well but it does post date Philip II by 400 years or so.  What corroborating evidence is there for wedge formations from the time they were claimed to have been used?
Title: Re: Cavalry Formations in the Hellenistic Period
Post by: Duncan Head on August 15, 2023, 11:01:25 AM
Quote from: Keraunos on August 15, 2023, 09:00:55 AMPicking up, belatedly, on Duncan Head's citation of Aelian, this is all very well but it does post date Philip II by 400 years or so.  What corroborating evidence is there for wedge formations from the time they were claimed to have been used?
None whatsoever. The world assumes that the tacticians are correct in ascribing the wedge to the Macedonians (and in Ailian's case, specifically to Philip). There's no mention of wedges in the battle-accounts (except for a small Persian wedge in one version of Granicus).