Koguryo DBA 3.0

[Dangun]

Does anyone know the source or author for the Koguryo army list in the DBX family of games, specifically DBA 3.0?

I had a couple of questions like...
* Why that starting date?
* What is intended by "Sonbae"? Does this mean the tribal group called Xianbei? Or is it a specific use of the Korean word for senior?

Thanks

[Duncan Head]

Originally Karl Heinz Ranitzsch. All three Korean lists start at 300, it was a semi-arbitrary choice back in the first DBM lists with no precise significance.

SonBae are an elite military order of youths, the Koguryo equivalent of the Hwarang. There may be something about them in KHR's "Three Kingdoms and an Empire" series in Slingshot some years ago. Brief mention at http://www.heosmartialarts.com/koguryos-sonbae-and-taekkyon/

[Dangun]

Thanks

I can see "sonbae" on the website of every second Taekwondo gym.
But the historical content of these sites is approximately nil.
The earliest use of the phrase taekkyon is, I believe, 18th century.

But I haven't found anything in the Koguryo anals, or secondary sources yet?

[Patrick Waterson]

A small amount of information here which seems to confirm Duncan's description as roughly the Koguryo equivalent of Hwarang.

Apparently 'sunbae' means "a man of virtue who never recoils from a fight," which would seem to suit SonBae.  Not sure if they should be exempt from recoil on the tabletop, though ...

[Dangun]

A small amount of information here which seems to confirm Duncan's description as roughly the Koguryo equivalent of Hwarang.

Apparently 'sunbae' means "a man of virtue who never recoils from a fight," which would seem to suit SonBae.  Not sure if they should be exempt from recoil on the tabletop, though ...

In modern usage, sonbae is the generic honorific a junior employee would use to refer to a senior employee, or a student in a lower grade would use to refer to a student in an higher grade.
It is curiously absent from the index of the Annals of Koguryo.

Provisionally, I think I call bulls#@t on "sonbae" as a historical military term.

[Dangun]

Is there any way of getting a copy of these?

Chinese Campaigns against Korea, 589-613 AD (174/22-26, 175/38, Karl Heinz Ranitzsch)
Three Kingdoms and an Empire: Ancient Korea (234/2-14, 235/1-8, 236/2-13, Karl Heinz Ranitzsch)

I don't want to repeat anything unnecessarily, that the readership may already be familiar with.

And I am dying to know where this sonbae thing comes from?

[Andreas Johansson]

You can always buy the DVD with Slingshot back-issues. At £35 it's pricey for just those articles - but I imagine you'll find much else of interest in it.

[Duncan Head]

I had a quick look through 234-236 last night and couldn't actually find any mention of sonbae; sorry if I steered you wrongly.

[Dangun]

I had a quick look through 234-236 last night and couldn't actually find any mention of sonbae; sorry if I steered you wrongly.

No, not at all.
The taekwondo connection was a good lead, which I had never considered before.
As too was the reminder to look at the Slingshot indices, and bringing my attention to Karl's articles.
Very helpful.

There are at least 3 ways I can see that the term Sonbae may have wiggled its way in.