Celts - do you find it Gauling how rulesets treat them...

[Erpingham]

Excellent overview Richard.  Thanks.

[Justin Swanton]

So, bottom line. There seem to be three types of Celtic foot: soldurii, straight warband and we can include Gaesati. How do each of these rate against -

Citizen hoplites
Elite trained hoplites like Spartans
Early Spanish
Etruscan
Italic tribes like the Volsci
Livian Roman
Polybian Roman
Macedonian
Seleucid

[Erpingham]

straight warband

But what does this mean?  Warband is a bit of a wargamer fantasy at best but if we take its most obvious meaning of topos-Celts, fierce charging, long sword wielding, start-off-well-but-fade, are these the mass of tribesmen or the soldurii class and their mercenary equivalents?  Or do the soldurii class fight mainly as cavalry?

[Justin Swanton]

straight warband

But what does this mean?  Warband is a bit of a wargamer fantasy at best but if we take its most obvious meaning of topos-Celts, fierce charging, long sword wielding, start-off-well-but-fade, are these the mass of tribesmen or the soldurii class and their mercenary equivalents?  Or do the soldurii class fight mainly as cavalry?

We can define them as tribal warriors, called out for a seasonal campaign and not part of any notable's retinue or mercenaries for hire.

[Jim Webster]

straight warband

But what does this mean?  Warband is a bit of a wargamer fantasy at best but if we take its most obvious meaning of topos-Celts, fierce charging, long sword wielding, start-off-well-but-fade, are these the mass of tribesmen or the soldurii class and their mercenary equivalents?  Or do the soldurii class fight mainly as cavalry?

We can define them as tribal warriors, called out for a seasonal campaign and not part of any notable's retinue or mercenaries for hire.

A bit like early 3rd century BC Roman Legionaries then 

[Justin Swanton]

straight warband

But what does this mean?  Warband is a bit of a wargamer fantasy at best but if we take its most obvious meaning of topos-Celts, fierce charging, long sword wielding, start-off-well-but-fade, are these the mass of tribesmen or the soldurii class and their mercenary equivalents?  Or do the soldurii class fight mainly as cavalry?

We can define them as tribal warriors, called out for a seasonal campaign and not part of any notable's retinue or mercenaries for hire.

A bit like early 3rd century BC Roman Legionaries then 

I actually had something like this in mind...

[Imperial Dave]

I had not thought to bury Caesar but only to contextualise him.

very good....

[Anton]

Et tu Dave?  Thank God someone got it.

[Erpingham]

Et tu Dave?  Thank God someone got it.

I'm sure many lent an appreciative ear .

[DougM]

Et tu Dave?  Thank God someone got it.

I couldn't possibly comment. After all we are all honourable men.

I'm sure many lent an appreciative ear .

[DougM]

Incidentally,  have just watched the toofatlardies live youtube broadcast about the upcoming Infamy,  Infamy  ruleset.  Bit concerned that Rich appears to be taking Livy, Procopius, Caesar etc at face value. More numerous barbarian trope alert.

[Tim]

So Doug, can we expect to see you left Livyed by the new ruleset...?

[DougM]

So Doug, can we expect to see you left Livyed by the new ruleset...?

Bilious perhaps..  no actually I'm quite looking forward to it as an opportunity to put some 28mm ancients on the table.

[aligern]

I didn't see Rich as taking Caesar et al. at face value.  Many of the references in Caesar are in his descriptions of Gallic politics, they neither advance nor retard his political objectives which ( if we can assume  that the commentaries are written as he goes along) are to tell folks innRome why he felt compelled to attack out of the Province
, start a war and add new areas to Rome's dominions which was not his original brief. A lot of the societal information is accidental to his purpose, so its highly believable. As to whether when he speaks of the 'senate' of a Gallic tribe it is something that meets regularly, has members that include wise men and Druids ,or is mainly aristocrats with military power, we do not know.
Something that suggests a fairly broad involvement is the attempts by such as Orgetorix to become kings. That implies a large body of men who can be appealed to over the heads of the aristocrats and threatens their power, hence why they are so against it and have anti regal policies enshrined in law.

Roy

[Erpingham]

I think Doug is suggesting if we take Caesar et al literally around his social structure/political writing, it implies we should do the same with his numbers and he thinks this is unwise.